HarleyTechTalk

Quote from: FlaHeatWave on July 20, 2017, 01:35:05 PM

Quote from: Ken R on July 18, 2017, 04:21:55 PM
What's wrong with the stock unit?  The newer ones are more robust than the originals and they don't seem to tend to over-tighten.  My 2010 would flex and then over-tighten as a result.  I put the later Rev unit in and sold the motorcycle at 20,000 miles.  My 2013 has its original tensioner and it seems to be working fine with 40K miles on the clock.

No issues / related issues with the OE Tensioner in the '09 SERG, been flawless for almost 60k miles so far.
Minimal wear, appears to have plenty of service life remaining...

Bringing the drivetrain up to operating temperature before employing any engine braking seems to be the trick to preventing any over-adjusting,,, rev-matching on downshifts doesn't hurt either...

I agree on getting the drive train up to temp but it takes a lot longer to warm compared to the engine. The downshifting and engine braking should not make the adjuster take a step because the slack is on the top in both those conditions. My problem has always been the main shaft flexing under acceleration load and the adjuster will take up the slack then it is too tight. The stock adjuster has been both the stongest and quietest I have found and with the slight spring action it has is works the best for me once converted to manual in the way Ron and Vic have been doing it.

Ron, is there a link or  can you describe how you did the modification?
Al

Quote from: Chippitt68 on July 20, 2017, 03:03:15 PMRon, is there a link or  can you describe how you did the modification?
Al

The frame needs to be EDM'd since it's extremely hard . It's a 5/16" x 1" slot about mid range of adjustment. The block can be drilled and tapped with decent quality toolage to either 1/4 x 20 or 1/4 x 28. Both will work. Determine the drill position to exit the top as shown in this pic. The bolt is trimmed to be no higher then the top of the block when the block is in range for correct adjustment otherwise the shoe will hit it before hitting the actual flat spot on top of the block. Clean threads and bolt and use blue loctite on final assembly. The pic shows a tapered washer under the button head cap screw with an anti rotation tab for the washer. This is optional and really not required. It just gives the button head a nice flat surface when it mates to the slight taper of the tensioner frame. My camera at the time sucks so sorry for the jagged views.
Ron

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Quote from: 1FSTRK on July 20, 2017, 02:24:04 PM

Quote from: FlaHeatWave on July 20, 2017, 01:35:05 PM

Quote from: Ken R on July 18, 2017, 04:21:55 PM
What's wrong with the stock unit?  The newer ones are more robust than the originals and they don't seem to tend to over-tighten.  My 2010 would flex and then over-tighten as a result.  I put the later Rev unit in and sold the motorcycle at 20,000 miles.  My 2013 has its original tensioner and it seems to be working fine with 40K miles on the clock.

No issues / related issues with the OE Tensioner in the '09 SERG, been flawless for almost 60k miles so far.
Minimal wear, appears to have plenty of service life remaining...

Bringing the drivetrain up to operating temperature before employing any engine braking seems to be the trick to preventing any over-adjusting,,, rev-matching on downshifts doesn't hurt either...

I agree on getting the drive train up to temp but it takes a lot longer to warm compared to the engine. The downshifting and engine braking should not make the adjuster take a step because the slack is on the top in both those conditions. My problem has always been the main shaft flexing under acceleration load and the adjuster will take up the slack then it is too tight. The stock adjuster has been both the stongest and quietest I have found and with the slight spring action it has is works the best for me once converted to manual in the way Ron and Vic have been doing it.

'Not speaking of any "special techniques", just being smooth with the throttle until up to temp on the first start of the day...

Isn't the slack is everywhere?? It "shows" more at the (open span at the) top because the adjuster is at the bottom??

'First I've heard of the main shaft flexing under acceleration causing over-adjusting?? (not doubting you, 'just never heard of it before?)

'Like most, I operate the majority of the time <3500, but I've wrung out the '09 when it was stock, SE Stage III, and now with the 117 /DD7, often 2-up / loaded, no issues??
no burnouts though...

Just wondering why some have Primary Tensioner issues and some don't

If you take the tensioner out and clean it, then remove the pin and tensioning/adjuster spring, grind the thick end of the wedge so it gives a flat and square (to the pin bore in the wedge) surface. Fit a bolt with a slot cut in the head so it locates around the pin in the body where the original spring's pin located. Slide the bolt, with a couple of nuts fitted to it, into the wedge and place the wedge back in place in the adjuster. Fit the adjuster back into the primary and adjust one of the nuts so as to obtain correct chain adjustment, then use the second nut to lock the first on in place.You may have to fit and remove the adjuster a few times to keep setting it in order to get the desired chain adjustment, but it can be done AND as there is no welding or drilling involved it can be done without a machine shop at your disposal and it is cheap. You will have to grind the bolt's hex head in order to fit it but again it is not complex.
This will give you a manual adjuster for a good price, AND as the plastic shoe is spring loaded to the sliding serrated wedge part of the adjuster, it gives a quieter primary than when using the expensive SE one or the V-Twin version. I have a V-Twin version and it makes a bit of noise but loud pipes hide that noise ! 
I also have a V-twin solid sprocket in there but my crank is trued and welded to support the 113" and S&S 640 cam-ed motor which runs 11.5:1 static compression.... CVO heads flowed with bigger valves and CVO110 cylinders bored to take SE 4.060" 11:1 pistons. Mikuni HSR48 on a super G manifold with an Altmann P3 ignition. Not finished jetting it yet and it should improve on the 121 torque and 127 rwhp figures I already have. Cases were bored as well while we were truing, pro-plugging and welding the crank. The cylinders were machined to give a good deck height after a base gasket was used, and a copper head gasket. I also used Ultima roller-rockers which give a slightly increased ratio which sets valve lift to 660 thou and a quicker opening/closing action. We also had to machine the heads to get the compression right and skim 20 thou off the top of the heads to restore valve geometry.....
And all this done in England..... www.fastlaneheadwork.co.uk is the company that built it.... Talk to Alex and tell him Bob sent you.....

Quote from: rbabos on July 20, 2017, 04:47:59 PM

Quote from: Chippitt68 on July 20, 2017, 03:03:15 PM
Ron, is there a link or  can you describe how you did the modification?
Al

The frame needs to be EDM'd since it's extremely hard . It's a 5/16" x 1" slot about mid range of adjustment. The block can be drilled and tapped with decent quality toolage to either 1/4 x 20 or 1/4 x 28. Both will work. Determine the drill position to exit the top as shown in this pic. The bolt is trimmed to be no higher then the top of the block when the block is in range for correct adjustment otherwise the shoe will hit it before hitting the actual flat spot on top of the block. Clean threads and bolt and use blue loctite on final assembly. The pic shows a tapered washer under the button head cap screw with an anti rotation tab for the washer. This is optional and really not required. It just gives the button head a nice flat surface when it mates to the slight taper of the tensioner frame. My camera at the time sucks so sorry for the jagged views.
Ron

Thanks.

Quote from: VDeuce on July 18, 2017, 02:44:45 PM
I've bent 2 of the Bakers. Now running stock auto adjuster welded.

No problems here with mine. Of course it's a lil modified.
I for seen it bending when I looked at how it was mounted. So I made a way for it to have three mounts to the primary instead of the 2 only at the lower.

Quote from: FlaHeatWave on July 20, 2017, 01:35:05 PM

Quote from: Ken R on July 18, 2017, 04:21:55 PM
What's wrong with the stock unit?  The newer ones are more robust than the originals and they don't seem to tend to over-tighten.  My 2010 would flex and then over-tighten as a result.  I put the later Rev unit in and sold the motorcycle at 20,000 miles.  My 2013 has its original tensioner and it seems to be working fine with 40K miles on the clock.

No issues / related issues with the OE Tensioner in the '09 SERG, been flawless for almost 60k miles so far.
Minimal wear, appears to have plenty of service life remaining...

Bringing the drivetrain up to operating temperature before employing any engine braking seems to be the trick to preventing any over-adjusting,,, rev-matching on downshifts doesn't hurt either...

The stock adjuster works for me as well. I have the original -A adjuster in my '08, just opened the primary after 40k, the chain slack was fine. The adjuster has a total of 67k on it, the adjuster shoe is worn, so it's getting a -B adjuster. They're supposed to be even better as far as not jumping teeth and over tightening.

Just a note to say I opened up my primary case and found my chain tight.  With effort, I could move the chain up and down by maybe a 1/4".  I'm not sure how the auto-tensioner is designed to work but I took mine out and replaced it with a V-Twin 18-8328 manual tensioner.  For anyone else using this manual tensioner, I suggest throwing the allen headed adjuster bolt away and to set it by hand to where you want it then lock it down.

My bike is a 2010.5 black CVO ultra.

x3 on the Baker adjuster. I bent two of them which the good people at Baker were kind enough to warranty. The last one went up for sale and a welded stock tensioner went back in

Since I have had the 39929-06B updated tensioner in the bike, I've checked it twice to see how it's doing. It doesn't tighten the primary chan nearly as much as the   39929-06A unit did.

Did my 20k service this weekend, that means all 3 fluids and new cams 

I have the Baker adjuster and found the same dilemma I had the last time I went to adjust it... the spec is 5/8" - 7/8". The slack was right at 7/8", but one tooth up on the adjuster made it a bit less than 5/8. It's that Pi thing... increasing the diameter of the circle & all. The chain hasn't stretched 1/8" in 15,000 miles. I always hear the dangers of chains being too tight, so I did what I did last time... buttoned it up & see ya in 5k.

 

SO HOT BIKES auto chain adjuster is the bomb

Not to be funny, but bomb is the word.


http://www.harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=73290.msg799695#msg799695

More than you ever wanted to know about chain adjusters.     


http://www.harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=27615.msg281105#msg281105

Quote from: Ohio HD on September 05, 2017, 08:07:24 PM
Not to be funny, but bomb is the word.


http://www.harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=73290.msg799695#msg799695

Holy sh*t please enlighten me

I pulled the cover and snapped a photo.

chain is a lil loose and it was hitting the lower part of primary

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