HarleyTechTalk

2013 FXDC stock. I'll soon be adding V&H Pro Pipes, SE intake, and a 255 cam. I have a PV for tuning, and I'm reading about wide band 02 sensors being preferred over the stock narrow band versions. Would it make sense for me to install them prior to tuning? I won't be having it dynoed. Thanks.

I'd tune it with the narrow bands. That's what it's going to run with (in CL)

My understanding (as communicated to me by my tuner) when we were doing mine was in higher performance situation builds he preferred to tune with both wide and narrow band together.   For that reason I had both bungs installed in the proper positions in the 2 sets of pipes we tuned.  He also ran sniffers tubes up the head pipes.  The real purpose was to confirm readings from each of the 3 methods while tuning all ranges.  If any closed loop areas were included the narrow band was important but the other 2 confirmed the levels at all positions in the system.  In open loop areas they just don't get read until  called for as closed loop. 

The above was on a dyno using TTS.

Pretty sure if you wanted to run the wide bands you would need the target tune module added to the PV. I used a auto-tune pro module on my 2006 Dyna, the narrow bands are replaced with wide bands and wired to the module which in turn feeds the PV data. The kit is about the same price has the power vision. Bob

Quote from: FXDBI on February 05, 2022, 08:55:16 PMPretty sure if you wanted to run the wide bands you would need the target tune module added to the PV. I used a auto-tune pro module on my 2006 Dyna, the narrow bands are replaced with wide bands and wired to the module which in turn feeds the PV data. The kit is about the same price has the power vision. Bob

Yes, I read that in the meantime. It seems like a lot of bother for not much gain except maybe on the track. Thanks all.

Quote from: Jim Bronson on February 06, 2022, 08:06:34 AMYes, I read that in the meantime. It seems like a lot of bother for not much gain except maybe on the track. Thanks all.

You'd have to do this (or TT) to use widebands at all with a PV. You would probably also have to have bungs for the WBs installed at the correct locations.

Quote from: Coyote on February 06, 2022, 08:10:20 AM

Quote from: Jim Bronson on February 06, 2022, 08:06:34 AMYes, I read that in the meantime. It seems like a lot of bother for not much gain except maybe on the track. Thanks all.

You'd have to do this (or TT) to use widebands at all with a PV. You would probably also have to have bungs for the WBs installed at the correct locations.

They are useless if in a spot they can't collect information (or the incorrect depth and angle).  The front head pipe can be a problem if you run an oil cooler adapter there.  The right front frame leg is also a consideration.  I believe that's part of the reason for tuning with 3 O2 sensing devices in place. Always able to confirm.  I believe the gain is how it runs throughout all ranges and throttle settings, not the final WFO graph you show your buddies.

I tuned a bunch of bikes with TT and AT Pro. I had the best luck with the widebands about 6-8 inches down from the heads. I always finished by doing a tune using the narrow bands and copying that closed loop area from the NB tune over to the WB tune.

To be clear I am not a tuner and do not have any tuning experience other than being allowed in the booth to learn.  I agree on the position of the WB sensor provided it isn't on the inside of the turn.  It must be in the flow.

I believe that tuning with both WB and NB sensors is helpful when WB sensor readings are distorted by the effects of "some" cam timing and exhaust characteristics that effect flow near the exhaust port.  In this case more information helps a good tuner compensate (usually) in the lower rpm.

I can't even get the PV to show up in Windows as a device. It connects to the bike and everything looks normal, but when I connect it to the PC, the PV screen shows the connection is active, and the Windows chime sounds, but there's no icon for the device. I've installed the WinPV software and updated the PV firmware, but still no luck. I even tried another cable. Perhaps it is a driver issue. Time to call support.

Sounds right to me. The PV will communicate with the WinPV software. Not sure what else you expect to happen but that's all you need.

If it updated the firmware then Windows is connected to the PV just fine. All you need is to use the PV software to work with the tune, or load another to the PV, or transfer the file to the PC.

Quote from: Ohio HD on February 06, 2022, 08:10:16 PMIf it updated the firmware then Windows is connected to the PV just fine. All you need is to use the PV software to work with the tune, or load another to the PV, or transfer the file to the PC.

    It doesn't show up has a device in windows, once the program is running and the PV hooked up you have to go into the power vision with the program (WinPV).  Different tabs in the upper left of the WinPV screen do the different functions your looking for. Windows doesn't recognize it so it doesn't show has a device.  Sit and play with it has its a bit of a learning curve.   Bob

I forgot to mention that I can't find the file PV_INFO.TXT, which is required. Communications with the PV is good, as I can download diagnostic data and ECM information that I previously downloaded from the bike to the PV. Today I'll try some other functions like downloading the present tune from the bike and then re-flash it. Then, I want to install a SE air filter and find a tune for it.

If you have file missing errors then you have other problems and should start over. The PV software installs easily. Once installed, just allow it to upgrade and after upgrade the PV unit. There is nothing you have to do manually unless you have a dealer/tuner license that allows access to the hidden tables.

Today I lived dangerously and married the PV to the bike. I load the original tune, and everything was fine. The bike starts and runs fine, although I haven't ridden it yet. There are no errors whatsoever either on the PV or on the PC. Everything works as promised, except for the missing pv_info.txt file. That means I won't be able to download tunes from the PV site, which makes the unit essentially useless. I submitted a service request, so I'm hoping they can help me get it sorted out.

You don't need a file to download tunes. Not sure why you think you're missing something.

Make an account on the DJ website, then you can download starter MAP files.

DynoJet

You can also email support and they'll send you a starter MAP based on your needs.

pv_info.txt file is for buying a tune license.  You already got that with your PV unit.

Quote from: Coyote on February 07, 2022, 04:42:14 PMYou don't need a file to download tunes. Not sure why you think you're missing something.

Here's the link I get while trying to download tunes. Without the pv_info.txt I can't get any further in the process.https://www.dynojet.com/pvtunes

To be honest, I think your mistake was not buying the unit from Fuel Moto. That's why I offered to help you. Looks like you need to register to use PV's site. Still, the file you say you need is created by the PV connected to your bike. It's a tune file easily created by the PV. There are instructions how to create it on PV's website.

I discovered I can substitute the pv_info.txt file by typing the bike info into the appropriate fields. I can then filter the results by the configuration and download the tunes I need. I'm still not sure why the file doesn't appear like it does in the videos, but it doesn't seem that I need it after all. I'll confirm this with Dynojet when I talk to them. Meanwhile, on with the show. Thanks for the hints.

Isn't the PV_INFO.TXT file for the PV-3 unit?

Quote from: Ohio HD on February 07, 2022, 07:55:13 PMIsn't the PV_INFO.TXT file for the PV-3 unit?

Could be. That would explain it.

Quote from: Coyote on February 07, 2022, 06:17:38 PMTo be honest, I think your mistake was not buying the unit from Fuel Moto. That's why I offered to help you. Looks like you need to register to use PV's site. Still, the file you say you need is created by the PV connected to your bike. It's a tune file easily created by the PV. There are instructions how to create it on PV's website.

By the time I read your message, I had already bought it. Otherwise I would have accepted your offer. I've adjusted my settings so I now get an email when any messages are received. I had this set up before, but it must have been reset when the site was upgraded.