HarleyTechTalk

Gents, I'm considering an oil cooler in anticipation of next season. The summer here in NYC with the traffic can get brutal. I have wanted to hook up a cooler for some time but I am not sure what unit works best.  I don't like the ones that run along the down tubes and I don't like the horizontal ones either.......out of guesses.

So I defer to you guys to tell me about what coolers you run and how they are serving you.  I saw something very interesting but does not apply, yet, to Shovelheads. Check out www.budsbikerparts.com.au and look at the Oil Bud.  The idea is fantastic because its under the bike and the construction is solid.

I'm betting that it can be retro-fitted to an FLH set up. Pricey but I like the idea.

BTW the bike runs like a new bike (better) and I'm just trippin' on what a ride it turned out to be.

  IMHO an oil cooler is big plus. I have the factory Lockhart still on mine, not real pretty but functional. I have a temp gauge on the dipstick and it rarely sees anything over 170 maybe 180 on the hottest July day.  This 93 runs so cool it scared me but I do have oil flow and I boiled the thermometer to check it.

  I know there's a lot of debate among the oil crowd as to running the oil too cool but I'm not a believer that you have to "boil" the water out.  In the really cold weather I do slap some black duct tape across the front of it.

  I keep threatening to get a nice cover for it but apparently I'm too much of a friggin redneck... 

Hey there is only so far I will go with the "pretty" sh*t, redneck or yankee.  Did you look at that Oil Bud I mentioned.Take a look at it. Being a wrench type I am sure you will at least like looking into it.

I noticed that my bike's temp was 180 after riding it around, and that was in cooler weather so I'm sure the oil is going to run like hot lava thus summer and I don't like the thought of it. Where is your cooler located?

     Rudy,
     I have not run a cooler on any of my Shovels but I do have a decent used Lockhart which is what the factory used on the late 70's and early 80's FXS's. Been thinking of bolting it on one of them over the winter but which one? Don't mean to turn this into an oil thread but consider using some Amsoil 60WT racing oil. It's what they recommend for Shovels. I tried some in my 83 FLHS 88" stock stroke big bore and she seemed to like it just fine. BYW that mill has VelvaTouch lifters and I was hesitant to go with the straight weight oil but it ran real sweet. Bill

Mine is up under the tree taking in the air coming over the fender. Like I said, not real pretty.

I checked the website, http://www.budsbikerparts.net/  for some reason I couldn't get your link to work for me.
It sure looks like a good idea but I'd almost have to see the fit and ground clearance. Built for a twinky but as we all know you can fit anything to just about anything with patience and perseverance.
   My shovel runs cool enough as is but I might be interested in it for TC but at $595.00 I'd have to really think about it for my kind of riding.  The times I'm in heavy traffic, or even in the city, any city, are very few and far between.

70s era Lockharts are on ebay for around $60.

- Mark

edit.... I had the link screwed up

Bill, no problem about the oil talk, its all part of the story. I am under the impression that straight 60w is too heavy for a tightly buily shovelhead motor and also for hydraulics. I get confused. I run 20 W50 HD and I'm hesitant to go any thicker. In an older motor where the tolerances are not as tight I always thought a sraight 60 would work fine so I'm learning something, especially that Amsoil 60 is used for racing, never really thought about it but then I bet the heat index is way up on the track.  "Stock stroke big bore" sounds like a good place for me to go. Bolt on and I don't have to split the cases. Another topic for sure.

Mark, Yep that thing is pricey but I like the design. If you watch the videos it shows the installation process and it does not affect the clearance at all. They even shot it with both barrels of a 12 ga. shotgun and the aircraft aluminum did not even dent.  Its an amazing idea. These guys build experimental aircraft so the technology is state of the art and from components used on aircraft.

I saw the $60.00 Lockhart specials on ebay I'm just not crazy about the look. I'm thinking of trying to retro fit one of the HD touring units that fit under the rectifier. Also, what do you think about the adapters on the oil filter vs. just splicing them into the oil lines?

"Stock stroke big bore" sounds like a good place for me to go. Bolt on and I don't have to split the cases.


that's not correct.  btw, I use a lockhart 400 oil cooler.  it mounts vertically on teh front tube (either sied) it was originally used for Sportsters but cools off my stroker pretty well.

NormL

Norm...I stand corrected..I forgot about having to bore the spigots to clear the larger pistons. Thanks for the reminder. 

I picked up an old Cadillac power steering cooler off of ebay- cost me $7, and it fits between the front downtubes.

Cool...I just checked it out on Ebay..thats a great idea. Send a photo when its installed.

www.budsbikerparts.com

Is the correct URL.  This guy is a little nuts, shooting at his coolers and stuff.  Pretty bullet proof eh?

BOB

 I hope the guys makes money on it, IMHO the TCs run too hot trying to satisfy the EPA but it makes me leary. I think a rock would be more like a slug than birdshot. I'd like to see him do that with 00 buck or a .357 or prop it up against something so it can't move.  Yeah I know, a stone is not going to be traveling at that velocity but I think the shotgun is just theatrics. If he actually touched off both barrels at once then the spread at that range is going to be so wide I would guess only 10% (or less) of the shot hit it.

My bike is lower than stock and I have never bottomed jumping a curb but there's always that chance. Heck my FLH still has the skid plate and I'm keeping it.  We snapped off the kickstand spring on my buddies evo RK when he bottomed it riding it up into a trailer.

If it truly fits up into the frame then I'd probably feel better about it, but then it ain't my bike or my money, just throwing out my .02.  

-Mark

     Rudy,
     I hear what you're saying about being hesitant to use straight 60wt this time of the season. The run-in for the 83 FLHS started in the fall was interupted by a Maine winter and started back up in the Spring. I was using 20W50 during the entire time. It can get pretty warm up here in the summer so that's when I switch over the the 60wt. Good luck in your oil cooler quest. Later, Bill

I think the 20W50 is fine for the modern bikes; but straight 50 wt for a shovel is a better solution.  Personally I think putting 60 wt in is overkill, somehting left for the boys in AZ.  Gets up in the 100's occasionally in summer here but I think an oil cooler and thermostat would be a better addition than gear lube in the crankcase.

BOB

When I was talking to Jim Leineweber about my (his) cam, he had lots to say about oil. He swears by HD grade 20w50 although he said he has heard from some guys in AZ that go as high as 70 in the dead of summer out there. Thats hotter than NYC will ever get even with traffic, but I know plenty of guys who do run 60 in their shovels in the summer here. Its just not for me. I have always used 20w 50 BUT I change my oil more often than most in the summer.  I will dump my oil after a long hot run but with a cooler that will not be necessary.

Rudy,

I agree with you that modern day 20w-50 oils work well in Shovelheads. I use nothing but 20w-50 full synthetic in mine and I'm in an area that runs consistently 90+ degrees all summer with periods of well over 100 degrees. I've never had an issue.

To address the oil cooler questions - I would never run a Shovehead without an oil cooler of some type. It simply is good insurance. I'm not too keen on the cooler that mounts under the bike for several reasons. First, you would either have to mount it under the bash plate or remove the bash plate. Secondly, you would have to run unprotected oil lines to it. Both leave it vulnerable to damage at the worst time and could leave you stranded somewhere. these bikes are low to begin with so simply leaving a parking lot with a steep driveway could be your demise. Another reason would be that, in order to work efficiently, they need to be in a direct air stream so the the best place in on the front downtubes in front of the engine directly in the airstream. I won't even get into the price.

If you do a little more checking, there are several options for coolers that would be less than noticeable on the front tubes. The original Lockhart (Which is what I run) is mounted high, painted black and is barely noticeable.  As NormL suggests, the Sportster cooler mounts vertically on the front downtube and, painted black, it would blend in. A horizontal cooler mounted high and painted black would also blend in.. Also mentioned was a power steeering cooler. They are cheap and work well. I used to use them exclusively on my British bikes in the '60s & '70s.

Another worthwhile investment would be an Oil Cooler Bypass Valve by Jagg. It allows you to bypass the cooler or direct oil through the cooler at will by merely flipping a switch.

Hope This Helps.

NormS

Hey Norm, Thanks for your valuable input. Yeah the cost of that oilguy thing is off the wall, I only sent it around for general interest. It is innovative but you are very right about the undercarriage being open to all sorts of "Potty mouth" on the road. I will figure something out but I am not going into next summer without an oil cooler.
Thanks again man.

Shovel should always have a cooler, they run too hot otherwise.  My first FXEF-80 would burn my right leg all the time bumping the rear head.  You could light stogies off that sucker it was so hot.  No mods to that bike operation wise only taco, like ride to live stuff...

My second one the 78 1/2 had the cooler that goes on the right downtube.  You can see a pic in the Gallery of that one.  Stuck out but looked OK I suppose, sure was visable.  Worked oK that bike was a lot cooler, was a 74 though.  This bike I'm rebuilding had a cooler with it.  It is the FXS type cooler up high.  Any oversized shovels should have a cooler.  I think they all should.  You do not need a thermostat on a shovel, they run too hot to begin with.

Rudy just buy the stocker and get over with it, hahahahaha.  I wouldn't put the chrome cover on though, they block too much air.

BOB

yeah Bob, I know...I'll end up with a Lockhart no doubt. NG on the chrome cover for sure, defeats the whole purpose.

back up some good oil with this Rudy..... http://www.gopurepower.com/

sweet $$$$ but very sweet. Thanks and that one gets filed in the "will do when I get some more bucks" file.

I've run a Lockhart 600 on a shovel and on a couple of evos I've owned, and I have a new one I'm keeping for a future project. The 600 is nice because it has a built-in thermostat. No oil flows thru the cooler until the oil temp reaches 180.

A lot of jap bikes ran them and if you can fab your own brackets, the kits for jap bikes can be had pretty cheap. On the back of the chrome part is a couple of mounting bolts.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/-AIR-COOLER-%22600%22-LOCKHART_W0QQitemZ190352757225QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxZ20091126?IMSfp=TL091126201008r9890

Thats real nice. I like the built in thermostat. Yep I might go with that one. Good lookin' out. 

I used to live in the area of Santa Clara, CA and did business with Zoom Cycles. They are a small shop but are honest and good to do business with. They cater to the Japanese bikes but took care of all of my Harley and BMW needs at the time. Good people - at least they were at that time.

Hope this helps.

NormS.

Norm,
Zoom is the retail mail order outlet for Ted's V-Twin.  They are out of CT. Darian I think.  Ted's is open to the public on a walk in basis. He is up near Newburgh, Orange County NY. Yes, next door to the OC chopper guys.  I lived up there for a while. It was VERY helpful having Ted's 10 minutes away.  I used to say that Ted ought to fly a skull & crossbones, his prices were so high but then when you need something and need it now you could walk in and have everything at your disposal.

Good 'ol Taiwan Ted.  I remember years ago Ted operated out of  an old barn. No "Potty mouth". He had a collection of Indians there that most museums do not have. You could rummage thru thousands of HD parts. Man those were the days.

Ted will only ship to dealers but Zoom handles his retail mail order.  I have ordered from Zoom and usually get stuff the next day cause NYC is so close. Gotta watch his prices though.

Unless there are two ZOOMs???

I like that cooler you showed me. I dig the built in stat.