HarleyTechTalk

I'm a bit confused here, is it the same?

xlfan

they are not the same.  SERT was once made by Mastertune, who now makes TTS....but SERT is no longer available...but Mastertune does offer a conversion package from SERT to TTS (for those who already have SERT). 

Soooo, does that mean that what the MoCo SE dept. sells now isn't SERT?


xlfan

Quote from: xlfan on January 30, 2011, 08:28:43 AM
Soooo, does that mean that what the MoCo SE dept. sells now isn't SERT?

correct, it's SEST. 

I have a Race Tuner that has never been installed.  Will the TTS SERT upgrade allow it to work with an 08 TBW bike?   Does the upgrade include the V-tune option as well?

Quote from: 03deuce on January 30, 2011, 04:11:29 PM
I have a Race Tuner that has never been installed.  Will the TTS SERT upgrade allow it to work with an 08 TBW bike?   Does the upgrade include the V-tune option as well?

PM Steve Cole for the TTS upgrade options, but I can say that TTS allows for v-tuning as part of it's standard package (on '05 and up ECM's equipped w/o2 sensors) 

Hey, thanks Mayor, will contact Steve.

I have a SERT that I am sending in to upgrade to the TTS for my 08 Ultra.  You can go to the TTS website and download the upgrade qualifier file to run to see if it qualifies.

Is the sest = to the tts? If not is there a upgrade?

It's like an ol discussion. A matter of varing opinons. IMHO, TTS is better than SEST, but that is my opinion.

Quote from: 01spring01 on January 30, 2011, 06:16:45 PM
Is the sest = to the tts? If not is there a upgrade?

I run TTS on one of my efi bikes, but I have never played with SEST.  From what I understand, SEST and TTS are similar, but TTS has more tools in the tool box plus allows for more adjustments.  Mastertune does not have any upgrade options for SEST that I know of, just the older SERT's. 

SERT = Screamin Eagle Race Tuner
SEPST = Screamin Eagle Pro Super Tuner
SESPT = Screamin Eagle Street Performance Tuner

TTS is comparable to the SERT, since Mastertune produced the SERT for MoCo for many years.  SEPST and SESPT are made by a different manufacturer.

To make things worse with the acronym game, the SESPT is for downloads by the dealer ONLY.  No tunable parameteres by the end user.  If you want to TUNE the bike or change parameters, you MUST buy the SEPST.  Dont mix up these acronyms, or you will be disappointed big time.

In any case, with all 3 of these MoCo devices, they all lock to the ECM once installed and cannot be used on another bike, ever.

As mentioned, PM Steve Cole with any TTS questions, as that is his company.

HTH

Dennis

Not sure if this has any bearing on this subject or if anyone cares, but I've been watching and reading the post on TTS vs SERT (and family) and have been looking at all the other new and old management packages for quite a while now.  I ride an 07 FLHR with a PCIII and put somewhere around 10k a year on it.   Everytime I think I know which system I'm going with something new comes out and then I listen to and read all the comparisons between the new product and all of the others.  While I do believe that competition is great for the motorcycle world, I find it difficult to choose which is best for me and my budget.  I wanted a little bit more low end power and torque so I did some research and chose the woods 6-6 cams (works for me).   I wanted a little quieter and cooler running bike than I've had in the past without hurting my pocketbook,  so I found a set of 2/1/2 takeoffs from an 09 touring and am leaning toward the jackpot mufflers fuelmoto has on sale.  I'm putting the exhaust on hopefully  in the near future if it ever warms up.  Now all I need is some sort of management system that I can work with and that I can tune myself and feel confident with.  I don't want to spend, spend, spend everytime I make a little change in my bike.  I went to a performance seminar at one of the somewhat local dealers a while back and although they where pushing their product (SESPT and SEPST) they did make one good point.  What if I'm out on the road and something go's wrong,  will I be able to get the part and support.  Valid question and I thought about that a lot with the PCIII that I had, but I always thought that I could just unplug it , put my o2 sensors back in and get a ways down the road.  Now with the cams and air cleaner that is no longer possible.  Not sure what to do or which management system is best for me.  I wish we had a polling section that we could just put all of the systems in and see how many members had what.  OK I'm done 

Quote from: RDKing07 on January 31, 2011, 03:28:48 AM
What if I'm out on the road and something go's wrong,  will I be able to get the part and support.  Valid question and I thought about that a lot with the PCIII that I had, but I always thought that I could just unplug it , put my o2 sensors back in and get a ways down the road.  Now with the cams and air cleaner that is no longer possible.  Not sure what to do or which management system is best for me. 

The TTS reprograms your stock ecm.  I have absolutely no fear about being able to get help on the road on my TTS bike, since all the data that is expected to be there still is.

"What if I'm out on the road and something go's wrong,  will I be able to get the part and support " ... neither the TTS or SEPST need any parts as they do not remain connected to your bike ...as for support... that's questionable with the SEPST ..IF a Dealer you visit uses them a lot they MAY know about them... a lot of the dealers I know still know little to nothing about them... calling HD will get you NO Support as they have none that I know of and will refer you to a dealer... At least on here you can contact Steve for TTS support ...and NO I'm not endorsing one over the other ... I use only the SEPST as I work at a dealer and have great luck with them ... 

Just stating the facts as I see them

Well that sums up the thought of breakdowns and tts,  just make sure you take it with you like you would a SERT on long trips.  I started taking the lab top with me so that won't be to much of a big deal.  Now I just need to figure out if I'm mart enough ta ues it.

Can't imagine what kind of problem you expect on a long trip unless you are worried about frying your ECM in which case your a screwed pooch.

Don't they all marry the bike and can not be used later if you got a new bike??

Dale, thats correct...they marry to the ECM.  Cannot be used on another ECM.  However, if your ECM dies, you can get a new ECM and programmed by the dealer for the bike and the tuner should work with that new ECM.  I suspect its married to the VIN id in the ECM, but not certain.

Dennis

Thanks Dennis for the info, I was wondering about that and how Harley could actually charge you for both if only the ECM went out.  Sorry XFLAM, I feel like I'm stealing your post.

1

Quote from: Dennis The Menace on January 31, 2011, 11:52:23 AM
Dale, thats correct...they marry to the ECM.  Cannot be used on another ECM.  However, if your ECM dies, you can get a new ECM and programmed by the dealer for the bike and the tuner should work with that new ECM.  I suspect its married to the VIN id in the ECM, but not certain.

Dennis

It marries to that 1 ECM - not by VIN: If you have to replace the ECM, then you need a new SEPST. I replaced an ECM  (at the customers request- nothing bad/wrong with it, but he was convinced it that had gone bad- demon possession) and I had previously tuned it- when I installed the new ECM, it accepted the standard OEM download, re-did password learn/security functions, all OK.  I went to re-flash his tuned map into the ECM and NOGO- I called Tech Services to check, and they verified it- the SEPST ( and I believe SESPT and TTS) marry to one specific ECM, and either the customer buys a new tuner or the factory resets his original unit.

Rigid, thanks for the info.  So the ECM must have a hex code that the tuner marries to, and not the VIN.  That would suck if the ECM goes tits up and has to be replaced.  Good to know up front tho.

Dennis

Damn
Once again that gives every thing a whole new perspective.  I think it would suck to spend all that time and money on a new TTS or SE product and have the ECM go out then need to buy it again.  Might need to talk to jamie and see what they have going .  At least I can take it from bike to bike

yea but factory ECM failures are very rare.   

After more than 15 years tuning these HDs I have personally only had a couple experiences with a failed ECM, which were replaced by the MOCO...and it was a MM EFi not Delphi. I HAVE heard of failures but it is extremely rare.
Plus I know TTS will happily reset your dongle if you need to replace the ECM due to replcement.

All depends how precise of a tune your a looking for. If you are happy with the PC and the way your bike runs why not make the changes and have it tuned then enjoy your ride.

Really no need to burn up brain cells trying to find something better...unless you also are willing to spend some money, regardless if it is an add-on to, reprogramming of, or replacement of the OEM system.
If and when the PC dies, then look to other remedies, and there should be more by then.

Good luck and hope this helps,
Bob