HarleyTechTalk

Quote from: Colt on November 17, 2013, 01:46:30 PM
Thanks for enduring with the pictures, SE.  Admittedly, nearly everything about which you speak is so far beyond one who has yet to change their own oil, yet even my pathetically-and-mechanically-challenged mind is able to appreciate the attentiveness to detail given to your work. 


--Colt

If you are taking that away, I do not consider your mind to be challenged at all.

Here is one of the most disappointing things that I have witnessed on this "CVO" motorcycle

Poor craftsmanship is a mental defect. I have had more than one leave my employ because of it. If they care, then it's a training issue. If they don't, I pay the rest of the day and send'em packing.
You can follow my rant here:
http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,68156.0.html

Lastly here are a few supplies that are needed, I like lint-less painters quality wipes and disposable gloves


Don't forget your home work


Good idea here!

I don't want to put my seat on and hit the starter only to swear "shucks ahhh slober" no battery!



I am off and running, all clearances, fitments, parts and references are laid out inspected and ready!
Dogs are fed, bills are paid,
A little bocephus to get the party started, or maybe tres hombres

The oil pan is a breeze without an engine tied in. You have a bit of room to tilt the tranny yar and fro, it sure makes it nice.

I learned a trick from a fine engine builder in the seventies that will stop vapor leaks where bare cases are joined. We built 1 or 2  Avco/Lycomming or Contennetal  aircraft engines a week with nothing more.
Bet you a coldbeer that I can stop that ugly black line that forms on top where the engine cases and tranny cases mate with only a silk string.

Quote from: SE Road King on November 21, 2013, 09:33:58 AM

I learned a trick from a fine engine builder in the seventies that will stop vapor leaks where bare cases are joined. We built 1 or 2  Avco/Lycomming or Contennetal  aircraft engines a week with nothing more.
Bet you a coldbeer that I can stop that ugly black line that forms on top where the engine cases and tranny cases mate with only a silk string.

In the 60s / 70s, I heard that using silk thread was the way to go, particularly on English bikes.. Not sure about string.. Might be too thick.. We used the stock gaskets and douched em with Gask-a-cinch..

Max

string thread

Winter hold!!!
Not enough heater in the garage to fight off the 30's

Bolting the lower end in is fairly straight forward. I went back in the original location with the intention of a full alignment after I have it up and running. I did purchase and replace the front elastomer bushing engine mount.

A little touch up to take some of the years of motorcycling off of the looks...

My new exhaust required a new tranny mount and I installed a new clutch cable. Careful with the torque on the tranny end of the clutch cable or you might get to do it again. If you ever have the tranny end cap off, pull the slinger/transverse rod out for inspections. The thrust bearing and the rod are cheap (if needed) compared to the repairs if they fail. Here it is all zipped up, ready for adjustment when I get the clutch back in the drive side.

Here I install the stator, Windex works well to aid getting the lead socket into the case hole. Remember to flip that lip on the back side. When pulling the connectors thru the conduit I use a long, thin wire tie to loosely join them in tandem then feed the uncut tie thru the conduit and pull with pliers.

Time for the inner primary, I did use new seals on the trans/main shaft and starter jackshaft. I use blue tape on the trans/main shaft to protect the seal from harm. The scripture is well written, use your bible here. You should put sealant on the threads of the bolts, not in the threaded holes.

Check your (5) lock plate tabs and install the starter jackshaft here, this will be your last access to them without pulling the primary chain.

Shoot both the shaft threads with brake clean and the nuts as well. Use a quality thread locker that has been stored properly or is new. If this stuff comes loose it can get nasty and expensive. It is a good idea to lay out your tools and parts so that this task can go start to finish without interruption. Clutch in right hand and shaft extension in the left install the chain draped between the two. A bit of rotation-fishing may be required to get the splined shafts to line up. When I torque these two nuts I prefer for my adjuster shoe to be removed. The bottom rung of chain really tweeks the adjuster when tightening because the inside of the inner primary has a fairly radicle draft at the bottom.

Setting the chain tension up sure is easy when every thing is clean and you don't have to work thru a dark hole.


A quick clutch adjustment and we move on.

SE Road King I'm darn sure envious of your expertise and equipment gettin this job done right! My 'Gracie' (2001 FLHR) is slated to go in for full engine re-build next month (not broken it just needs to be done with 120K on the motor)........I trust my indy completely - just wish I could watch the entire process................

Stuffing jugs is fun. Read your bible and devise a way to get flawless results.





From a Carrier of 40 years in the machine and manufacturing trades I have tools that are not listed by the good book and do not intend to purchase more.



So here I focus on flawless results using those tools. No real secrets to withhold, don't break or scratch anything and make sure that your seals will seal.



I did have to make mods to my new ring compressor that would allow the jug to envelope all of the rings without bottoming on the band of the ring compressor and my parallels.

Quote from: texaskatfish on November 27, 2013, 04:51:37 AM

SE Road King I'm darn sure envious of your expertise and equipment gettin this job done right! My 'Gracie' (2001 FLHR) is slated to go in for full engine re-build next month (not broken it just needs to be done with 120K on the motor)........I trust my indy completely - just wish I could watch the entire process................

That is good mileage, for the bike that you have. When I hopped mine up in 2003 I had figured 75k maybe more, and was headed in that direction until a cam bearing let loose @ 69k. Now days folks are getting 100+k on 100HP mills regularly.
Did any of this winter BS make it down there?

that boy of yours ought to be there in the shop helping so he can pick it up.....

Great thread and entertaining write up. Appreciate the effort taken to post the pics, ya seem to have it down pat. Looking forward to the sound file of start up 
Can you help me understand string theory, lol? Seriously, do you like make a gasket with the silk thread or wind a ring of thread around the dowels? 

It is real and serious business. I worked at one of (5) companies in the entire US that was certified for crank shaft grinding, rebuilding and repair. They repaired and re-ground camshafts was also a certified aircraft power plant build and rebuild facility for reciprocating piston engines under 1,000 Horse Power. Mostly Avco/Lycoming and Continental horizontally opposed 4 and 6 cylinder engines. Most of which had gaskets that were used similar to automotive gaskets.  Horizontally opposed engines with engine cases that split were some times sealed with silk thread. I do not know how familiar you are with FAA policies and procedure, but there were standards for the use of silk thread for sealing. Pages of them, with lots of conditional rules. In most situations dual threads were used where the flange width supported. I was a machinist there and got to poke my head into the clean room from tine to time and learn a few things while the engine builder was fitting up power plants.
Anyway, I bought a 2002 Screaming Eagle road King and it developed a black oil stained line at the seam between the engine cases and the transmission cases. As engines got hot and cold then oil and moisture would work there was into the cavities where the engine and tranny meet, they would leave a hideous vapor line there. Some were better than others, because it had to do mostly with the surface finish that the facing cutters left behind. Later processes allowed for a finish cut at finer feed rate and leaving behind surfaces that tended not to be as troublesome. I identified in 2003 that if I used a silk thread just at the top seam then the vapor would not leave a trail at the only seam that was widely viewable.
My dealer was told not to repair any more of these warranty claims by the time that I had developed ugly eyesore on my $25,000 machine, the thread can be inserted anytime that the primary is off. I was not pleased and vowed to silk thread mine the first time I had it apart. I knew that it worked because I told as many as I could about it and they were all much happier. This was my first opportunity, so I lived with the ugly black line there for years.

Quote from: -deuced- on November 27, 2013, 06:57:09 AM
Great thread and entertaining write up. Appreciate the effort taken to post the pics, ya seem to have it down pat. Looking forward to the sound file of start up 
Can you help me understand string theory, lol? Seriously, do you like make a gasket with the silk thread or wind a ring of thread around the dowels? 

For the purpose of eliminating the vapor stain that existed between my cases, I just laid a thread between the cases to seal the top seam only. I do not care if the stain appears any where else, they will not be nearly as noticed.

Quote from: wholehog on November 27, 2013, 05:24:57 AM
that boy of yours ought to be there in the shop helping so he can pick it up.....

Hopefully when he is old enough. He will be 4 in March. At least now he gets a charge out of revving the engine up and making the horn work, last year he was afraid of the bike.
He tells everyone that his grand-pa has a moracycle

...I just laid a thread between the cases to seal the top seam...


I'm guessing silk thread is about 0.002 or 0.003 and maybe not a problem on a horizontal surface but how did you hold it there while you mated the casings?

From Wiki I found the thickness of a silk strand to be approximately one denier. Denier is defined as the mass in grams per 9000 metres. So a five and a half mile long strand of silk weighs about three hundreths of an ounce. Man, that's pretty thin. I'm gunna have to get a new ruler, beesdicks and poofteenths just don't cut it no more.

I know what you mean about vapour leaks. I've used sealant in the past (fairly sparingly according to my old ruler) in other applications to prevent it but I've never worked on anything as critical as an aircraft engine.

Great thread, i have question, why didnt you install the jugs and heads before putting the motor on the bike?

I'm guessing silk thread is about 0.002 or 0.003 and maybe not a problem on a horizontal surface but how did you hold it there while you mated the casings?

[/quote]
Perhaps slightly thicker, I was an employee there in '76, '77, so I do not recall the thickness. However, I do remember that when we opened engine cases that had been sealed with silk there really was not much more than a stain where the thread had been. I am guessing that heat caused the thread to melt down and fill the valleys left from machining. The application was primarily used where the case halves where joined together providing an exact dimension for the enclosed components, (Crankshafts and/or Camshaft with pushrods and tappets come to mind)
Syliva was used to paste the tread onto case flanges, the ole timer pulled the thread from his mouth and used his thumb or finger to squeegee it as he laid it out.
A quality semi hardening gasket sealant will do the trick when the lower end was out. But, not as easily applied when only loosening the 4 case bolts and using leverage or a jack to separate the top seam.