Power Vision questions

[hdmanillac]

The consumption is my calculation after a fill up at gas station. I've never used the consumption indicator of the PV.

Thanks for your help.

Now AT Pro kit is removed. NB sensors are back on the bike and the new cal is in the ECM.

Test tomorow evening.



Is it possible to run Open Loop with AFR 13 definitely ? My feeling was excellent with the bike like this during AT Pro sessions.

[joe_lyons]

You can do whatever you wana do but I like my true 50 miles to the gallon that my bike is getting.  There would be no point in the narrow bands if you don't utilize the afr table for them.

[hdmanillac]

Waouh 50MPG, without any compromize on performance, that would be great !

[hdmanillac]

After VE completion, is it necessary to smooth the surface. I 've got some pings due to VE variation between 2 contiguous cells.

[HV]

I must say.... I just came back from a trip to Laconia with my PV Tuned bike... my Fuel Milage was unreal... I got 50 MPG   at times..and the bike Ran two up most of the time with a full load ... a roll on up a hill in a passing lane in 6th Gear gave me NO Pinging or any need to down shift to 5th  ..Very impressive ...

[joe_lyons]

I must say.... I just came back from a trip to Laconia with my PV Tuned bike... my Fuel Milage was unreal... I got 50 MPG   at times..and the bike Ran two up most of the time with a full load ... a roll on up a hill in a passing lane in 6th Gear gave me NO Pinging or any need to down shift to 5th  ..Very impressive ...

Have you calibrated your mpg setup.  When I first got mine hooked up it was saying that I was getting 55mpg until I got it calibrated.

[HV]

Yes it was 54 before ... now its 50 ... but has been a bit above in bad weather riding below the speed limit for a long time

[upnorthbiker]

Hi,
Ive got a 2011 V-rod Muscle and after an Autotune Pro some time ago, put the standard sensors back in and the bikes ran like a champ. Really smooth, even at 2000 rpm in 5th ( only for testing purposes ) plus an added bonus as fuel consumptions been averaging 38 mpg with a best of 41 mpg. Mods include Remus slip ons, standard baffles and K & N filter. Mileage is around 4200 miles.
Then 2 weeks ago after a road trip it started getting a bit jerky, hesitant even surging at low steady throttle openings. Still pulls strong and smooth but as soon as the throttles held for a constant speed the problem starts. To add to this problem the tickover rpm has dropped and is far from steady. No codes are showing. The fault is a bit worse when the engine is hot. Theres also a distinct delay when the throttles blipped to the engine rpm rising.
Ive replaced the spark plugs and checked all sensor plugs and wires. Throttle cables are lubed and adjusted ok. Throttle body sync is fine. Ive ran a fuel additive and always use premium fuel. IAC cleaned. No Exhaust or intake leaks seem present.
Ive been running with the PV display fitted to monitor displayed cells. All display seems ok, only one I am not sure of is of the MAP sensor, it shows no steady readings, even at tickover. Is this expected for this sensor ?
How else can I utilise the PV to help me fix my bike ?
I ride quite a bit between 2000 and 4000 rpm, could this have caused the fault ? will these rpms damage a v-rod engine ?
Thanks,
Jeff

[joe_lyons]

I doubt those rpms would hurt at all.  Hook up the PV and see what your AFF and CLI percentages are in the areas that feel bad.  Post your map so we can have a look see.   

[rbabos]

Hi,
Ive got a 2011 V-rod Muscle and after an Autotune Pro some time ago, put the standard sensors back in and the bikes ran like a champ. Really smooth, even at 2000 rpm in 5th ( only for testing purposes ) plus an added bonus as fuel consumptions been averaging 38 mpg with a best of 41 mpg. Mods include Remus slip ons, standard baffles and K & N filter. Mileage is around 4200 miles.
Then 2 weeks ago after a road trip it started getting a bit jerky, hesitant even surging at low steady throttle openings. Still pulls strong and smooth but as soon as the throttles held for a constant speed the problem starts. To add to this problem the tickover rpm has dropped and is far from steady. No codes are showing. The fault is a bit worse when the engine is hot. Theres also a distinct delay when the throttles blipped to the engine rpm rising.
Ive replaced the spark plugs and checked all sensor plugs and wires. Throttle cables are lubed and adjusted ok. Throttle body sync is fine. Ive ran a fuel additive and always use premium fuel. IAC cleaned. No Exhaust or intake leaks seem present.
Ive been running with the PV display fitted to monitor displayed cells. All display seems ok, only one I am not sure of is of the MAP sensor, it shows no steady readings, even at tickover. Is this expected for this sensor ?
How else can I utilise the PV to help me fix my bike ?
I ride quite a bit between 2000 and 4000 rpm, could this have caused the fault ? will these rpms damage a v-rod engine ?
Thanks,
Jeff

Had the same problem. Had to open loop these effected areas. 2,4,5% tps at around 30kpa. It would never tune it out in basic however wasn't bad at fresh cal load. Over a short time steady state miss would occur and progessively get worse over time,  exactly at 5% at any rpm from 2250-3750. Mind you I have a DX with Factory exhaust with ST big shots. Since open loop in this area with ve blends and fattening up the afr in this area it's been Honda smooth in slow accel and steady state in all these previous problem rpms. 37 mpg is the best I've seen. Hottest days seem to get sightly better mpg then colder days. About .5 average difference.
Ron

[FLTRI]

FWIW, IME a well tuned Dyna should get over 40mpg...even on cornfuel.
Bob

[strokerjlk]

Hi,
Ive got a 2011 V-rod Muscle and after an Autotune Pro some time ago, put the standard sensors back in and the bikes ran like a champ. Really smooth, even at 2000 rpm in 5th ( only for testing purposes ) plus an added bonus as fuel consumptions been averaging 38 mpg with a best of 41 mpg. Mods include Remus slip ons, standard baffles and K & N filter. Mileage is around 4200 miles.
Then 2 weeks ago after a road trip it started getting a bit jerky, hesitant even surging at low steady throttle openings. Still pulls strong and smooth but as soon as the throttles held for a constant speed the problem starts. To add to this problem the tickover rpm has dropped and is far from steady. No codes are showing. The fault is a bit worse when the engine is hot. Theres also a distinct delay when the throttles blipped to the engine rpm rising.
Ive replaced the spark plugs and checked all sensor plugs and wires. Throttle cables are lubed and adjusted ok. Throttle body sync is fine. Ive ran a fuel additive and always use premium fuel. IAC cleaned. No Exhaust or intake leaks seem present.
Ive been running with the PV display fitted to monitor displayed cells. All display seems ok, only one I am not sure of is of the MAP sensor, it shows no steady readings, even at tickover. Is this expected for this sensor ?
How else can I utilise the PV to help me fix my bike ?
I ride quite a bit between 2000 and 4000 rpm, could this have caused the fault ? will these rpms damage a v-rod engine ?
Thanks,
Jeff

Had the same problem. Had to open loop these effected areas. 2,4,5% tps at around 30kpa. It would never tune it out in basic however wasn't bad at fresh cal load. Over a short time steady state miss would occur and progessively get worse over time,  exactly at 5% at any rpm from 2250-3750. Mind you I have a DX with Factory exhaust with ST big shots. Since open loop in this area with ve blends and fattening up the afr in this area it's been Honda smooth in slow accel and steady state in all these previous problem rpms. 37 mpg is the best I've seen. Hottest days seem to get sightly better mpg then colder days. About .5 average difference.
Ron

Make it happy   

[rbabos]

FWIW, IME a well tuned Dyna should get over 40mpg...even on cornfuel.
Bob

Dyna sure and even more. V rod, 40 is a tall order even with the cruise clbs set to 500, the fatter low end kills mpg but needed to make it run as it should. Oddly enough I spend a lot of time in the 4-5% range 14.0 afr, between slower riders, traffic and going through towns. Burning more fuel here is a worthwhile trade off for me. I'll take silky smooth over the miss/hickup running any day. Bought the v rod knowing the milage would suck compared to the BT and it didn't let me down. Have seen 38 mpg on the PV once on longer cruise runs where it's in closed loop so not too far out of the picture.
Ron

[upnorthbiker]

Hi  joe_lyons50023,
Hooked up the PV tonight and went for a short run to get some info for the reply.
Dont know if I didnt do it right but Front and Rear both CLI and AFF showed 100% all the time, when riding, at tickover. I
When I selected these guages I used the default settings, so not sure if I havent done something right or I have a problem.
I have attached the map I made using the AT100 kit I already had from a previous bike and used it with the Powervision.
Thanks to the riders on this forum for the help, I really appreciate it.
Jeff


[attachment removed after 60 days by system]

[rbabos]

Hi  joe_lyons50023,
Hooked up the PV tonight and went for a short run to get some info for the reply.
Dont know if I didnt do it right but Front and Rear both CLI and AFF showed 100% all the time, when riding, at tickover. I
When I selected these guages I used the default settings, so not sure if I havent done something right or I have a problem.
I have attached the map I made using the AT100 kit I already had from a previous bike and used it with the Powervision.
Thanks to the riders on this forum for the help, I really appreciate it.
Jeff

I noticed the same with the CLI. Reading 100 +/- a couple with the bike running like crap. I stopped looking at it. Our ve tables are fairly close. If interested I can send you my cal as a comparison and reference for the low end. Not that mine is a quality tune but it has no more ill running in the low end below 4k.
Ron

[upnorthbiker]

Hi rbabos,
My CLI and AFF are stuck on 100% they dont even move +/- 1 or 2.
The bike ran great until the trip away like I said in my opening post.
Thank you for the offer and I would like to try your map for a comparison and I will update you on any difference.
You are very welcome to try mine.
I look forward to the weekend and hopefully find a fix.
Jeff

[rbabos]

Hi rbabos,
My CLI and AFF are stuck on 100% they dont even move +/- 1 or 2.
The bike ran great until the trip away like I said in my opening post.
Thank you for the offer and I would like to try your map for a comparison and I will update you on any difference.
You are very welcome to try mine.
I look forward to the weekend and hopefully find a fix.
Jeff

Like I say, just for low end comparison, and then if needed shift your map in the same direction as needed. I wouldn't use my complete cal since you could be more dialed in better in some areas and exhausts are different.
I had to extend my open loop areas due to it still reverting over time. Since that it's been stable. Failing that AFF will be 0'd out.  Pm your email and I'll fire it off.
Ron

[upnorthbiker]

Hi rbabos,
PM sent.
Jeff

[joe_lyons]

Select a data page that has the six position setup.  Then you need to have both CLI, both AFF, Map and throttle position displayed.  The AFF is a data stream that you will have to enable through the setup to enable advanced data to view AFF.  The AFF is the long term learned percentage and the CLI is the short term.  If the CLI is at say 80% for 20sec or so the AFF will start changing to get the CLI closer to 100 so AFF will start going to 80% so then the cli will hover close to 100.  But if you are not even having the CLI move at all then you are out of closed loop and you tune is degrading without the nb sensors affecting it.  I'm on my phone right now but is this area that you have a problem set to 14.6 on the AFR table in the calibration?  Weird that it was such a sudden change.?

[rbabos]

Come to think of it, my CLI were showing 100% in areas I switched to open loop. Seems I recall the cal he posted was all 14.5. That might be the connection, but I agree drastic change should not have happened in full open loop. I had some drift in mine but further extending the open area stopped it.
Ron

[upnorthbiker]

Hi Joe,
They are set at 14.5
Jeff

[joe_lyons]

If your AFR table is set to 14.5 then closed loop is turned off and there was no point in putting back in your stock sensors.  The afr table has to be set to 14.6 to have closed loop turned on and then to go richer or leaner from 14.6 you alter the bias tables. Try setting your afr in the map load areas that you have issues to 14 and then add a couple deg of timing in that same area and see how it does.

[hdmanillac]

When do you think Power Vision will deal with MAP Tooth IVO and IVC ?

[ben31]

When do you think Power Vision will deal with MAP Tooth IVO and IVC ?

+103 !

Could be very usefull to get the best of perf cams as Wood & Cie...

And by the way, what about EGR/CDE in PV? Any evolution soon to help a good and accurate tuning?

[joe_lyons]

They have it but it is not released as of yet to everyone.  If you wish you can have dynojet redo your map tooth figures to match your cams.


Lower cde by the % you want to lower VE values. Note it only affects 60 kPa and below.