7.....107'' mosquito killers

[Tynker]

HD seems to be very interested and responsive fixing all of the issues, glass half full.
Plus just because something malfunctions this doesn't mean the design (engineering) is deficient, throwing out the baby with the bath water.

Agree. Its way early. But it does make me wonder how Indian could create a clean sheet of paper power plant with their 111 and have virtually no issues. Better engineers or just lucky?

Indian did have problems with the first year 111. It seems like the exhaust valve seats had a interference problem fit, and would come out of the heads. Indian  replaced some of the bikes, on the spot, others were repaired.

[HV]

The new M 8 Has a new breather system close to the Sporty Type...the Breather Valves are completely different ..should fix the carry over issues

[Don D]

Problem with Internet information is it is too readily available and taken out of context plus stirred a bit no way of forming intelligent data based conclusions. The scientific method and root cause analysis gets circumvented, bypassed, and a lot of bias and noise is injected.
Give these bikes and the MOCO a bit of time to get these released in significant numbers. Time will tell.

[92flhtcu]

Don't want anybody to think I was bashing, I was just reporting what I have sen and what has been told to me by a engineer out of the Pilgrim/Juneau facilities
I was at a dealer today that had one in pieces, a piece of slag jammed in oil pump, new engine on the way

I have seen one new Indian 111 (brand new, never left dealer) with a broken valve spring, spring should have never been installed, it was so over heated it was purple, just missed by a assy tech at the plant

I really like the new engine, power, smooth, just not a beta tester, more like 5 yrs when I'd start looking, but thats me

[WI Bob]

Agree. Its way early. But it does make me wonder how Indian could create a clean sheet of paper power plant with their 111 and have virtually no issues. Better engineers or just lucky?
[/quote]

[HV]

I doubt if Indian or Victory for that Matter have had less new product issues or have a superior product ......its just that your not on a Indian tech Talk Forum with over 21000 members from all around the Globe reporting seen and sometimes heard of Issues 

[rbabos]

Agree. Its way early. But it does make me wonder how Indian could create a clean sheet of paper power plant with their 111 and have virtually no issues. Better engineers or just lucky?

[/quote]
Probably. I don't think they had a 7 year compensator issue. Vic did but resolved it real fast.
Ron

[Tattoo]

Problem with Internet information is it is too readily available and taken out of context plus stirred a bit no way of forming intelligent data based conclusions. The scientific method and root cause analysis gets circumvented, bypassed, and a lot of bias and noise is injected.
Give these bikes and the MOCO a bit of time to get these released in significant numbers. Time will tell.

kind of like when the 110" bolt on kits came out and the sky was falling and many said most of them would fail. I was at the MOCO dealer show in Boston and was talking with dealers all over the world and none of them have had any major issues with the 110" or 117" bolt on kits. time will tell for sure but so far we have not seen any smoking from the new motors. I think they should run Gatermen lifters and all problems would be solved. 

[biglew55]

I'm doing an IB1000 this weekend to see how well it deals with sustained high-speed running.

I'm curious what you find for fuel efficiency during this run.  I'd like to see what kind of MPG the new engines get when pushed at higher MPH for long periods.

I know my bikes will drop to 35 or sometimes 30 mpg when killing miles on the slab.  If this new motor can pull a few tanks at interstate speeds without dropping the range below 35, that would be great news.

[Xyzzy]

I'm doing an IB1000 this weekend to see how well it deals with sustained high-speed running.

I'm curious what you find for fuel efficiency during this run.  I'd like to see what kind of MPG the new engines get when pushed at higher MPH for long periods.

I know my bikes will drop to 35 or sometimes 30 mpg when killing miles on the slab.  If this new motor can pull a few tanks at interstate speeds without dropping the range below 35, that would be great news.

I ran a tank at 75 MPH today into a moderate headwind. I got 38 miles per gallon. The rest of the trip I did my usual 65 miles per hour, when traffic was light. Those tanks averaged 49 miles per gallon. I only did 700 miles because the temperature dropped from 91 F during the day to 55 F at night!

2,100 problem-free miles so far!

[Sunny Jim]

I figure it is early days and clearly the M8 will need to receive ownership and miles, lots of miles, But are they vastly superior to the Rushmore series tourers or have we seen the best in the twin cam series?
Just asking!

[yobtaf103]

Heres a smokey on a dealer promo youtube vid Gateway HD IL

https://youtu.be/AKyqKUermtU

[Ohio HD]

  How did that make it out....     

[SixShooter14]

A little smoke. But not too heavy. Have any of the dealers let it warm up to see if the smoke cleared?

How many times in a day do they start it rev twice and shut it down?

[Templer]

I myself have only witnessed 1 107 oil cooled M-8 start up. NO problem. I would wonder if the Euro 4/EPA would certify it with  the new cars/trucks/bikes starting with a smoke issue?? It would fail quickly and be a  smog issue would it not. A REAL smoke problem would cause a recall??

[rbabos]

I myself have only witnessed 1 107 oil cooled M-8 start up. NO problem. I would wonder if the Euro 4/EPA would certify it with  the new cars/trucks/bikes starting with a smoke issue?? It would fail quickly and be a  smog issue would it not. A REAL smoke problem would cause a recall??

Oil smoke on startup in any shape or form is unacceptable for a new engine unless it has issues. It will also drive up oil consumption and rapidly increase plug fouling from carbon build up. Yes it would fail.
Ron

[HV]

We have done PDIs on all of the 107s we have in so far ...we do a Condition report after unpacking ( run bike till its at operating temp ) then print off a sheet of all sensor readings...the bike is then ridden for at least 10 KM to check controls...and seat brakes in ... NONE have had a smoking issue seen on that VID...YET ...  The 4 Demo bikes on the lot are started every day and ridden....no smoke.......YET 

[04 SE Deuce]

Maybe Harley can get a "Zika" environment exemption.

The new 2017 abatement model...the green alternative!!!   

[lickidysplit]

I went to a dealer the week after they arrived . they started a bike for me so I could see how it sounded and I noticed rite off that it smoked like a cho cho train.

[jbexeter]

I went to a dealer the week after they arrived . they started a bike for me so I could see how it sounded and I noticed rite off that it smoked like a cho cho train.

Engineer hat on.
HD rider hat off.
Knocking moco hat off.

A newly assembled engine you'll expect smoke, depending on the engine and lube used and gaskets used and so on, possibly asmokehouse tone of smoke.

BUT

It will burn off right quick, get it up to temperature once and all the gasket / ring / guide etc excess lube will burn off.

No engine leaves a factory nowadays, not just HD, every factory, even enfield india, without being run up and given a quick set of tests to make sure everything is ok.

That vid clip we saw, something seriously wrong, could be a trivial thing*** that is easy to fix, but NO new engine should smoke like that, even if all it does is start, get two blips for a customer and shut down.

In that clip, that oil was sitting there IN the combustion chamber waiting for the start, dunno how it got there, but it was already there before the start.

*** could be some asshole design fluke with some oil being siphoned through a defective breather on shutdown easily fixed by flipping a gasket the right way around, who knows.

I would not expect to see that amount of oil before 50k hard miles, and then it should clear as soon as the motor warms.

[glens]

Smartass hat on, they accomplished 2 things with the new design: prevent oil from entering the intake via the labyrinth breathers (dropping it directly into the cylinders instead), which helps with the second goal of less heat transfer to the hard parts (by ensuring sufficient thermal barrier formation). 

"They all do that!"

[rbabos]

I went to a dealer the week after they arrived . they started a bike for me so I could see how it sounded and I noticed rite off that it smoked like a cho cho train.

Engineer hat on.
HD rider hat off.
Knocking moco hat off.

A newly assembled engine you'll expect smoke, depending on the engine and lube used and gaskets used and so on, possibly asmokehouse tone of smoke.

BUT

It will burn off right quick, get it up to temperature once and all the gasket / ring / guide etc excess lube will burn off.

No engine leaves a factory nowadays, not just HD, every factory, even enfield india, without being run up and given a quick set of tests to make sure everything is ok.

That vid clip we saw, something seriously wrong, could be a trivial thing*** that is easy to fix, but NO new engine should smoke like that, even if all it does is start, get two blips for a customer and shut down.

In that clip, that oil was sitting there IN the combustion chamber waiting for the start, dunno how it got there, but it was already there before the start.

*** could be some asshole design fluke with some oil being siphoned through a defective breather on shutdown easily fixed by flipping a gasket the right way around, who knows.

I would not expect to see that amount of oil before 50k hard miles, and then it should clear as soon as the motor warms.

They know but don't talk to us. Unless they are complete idiots, this has been experienced in the supposed 15 month test period. Sometimes production deadlines are more important . Issues can be dealt with later on a one on one basis, while the main cause is dealt with for future runs.
Ron

[HD/Wrench]

Had the chance to test ride the 114 version.. Salesman start's the bike up and its running on one cylinder.. big cloud of blue smoke smoke in the show room blows into the show room ( front doors are open) !!!    i am thinking  I say nothing just look at the sales guy. He revs the "Potty mouth" out of it a few times and smiles and says here you go.. I said" it does not sound right "  another smile he says thats how the new ones sound.. I tell him no thanks not looking to walk back today.. I am trying not to laugh out load as I stroll away.  No way would I have ridden it . it would barley run 

BTW before I left some one did in fact take it out for a ride. No idea if he made it back I was  there at least another 30 minutes and did not see it pull back up . 


But I did get a new sticker for my truck if that matters .

[VDeuce]

/quote]
They do make nice stickers! 

[jbexeter]

Had the chance to test ride the 114 version.. Salesman start's the bike up and its running on one cylinder.. big cloud of blue smoke smoke in the show room blows into the show room ( front doors are open) !!!   

See, I'm just some guy on the internet who has been swinging his leg over HD since the shovel days, more miles than some, less miles than some...

When you get people who live and breathe AND work commercially with big twins every day of their lives, and when those people can have / express that reaction.

As the saying goes, there is something seriously wrong in the state of denmark, even if it is only that alien body snatchers have replaced all the mechanics and sales droids in that dealership to allow that particular bike into the showroom.