HarleyTechTalk

I do appreciate the comments.

QuoteWhy don't you get it all apart and CLEANED and inspected before you assemble anything?

To me, "assembly" includes the cleaning of the parts, running a thread restorer down the bolt holes and blowing out with air, cleaning the bolt threads with a wire (brass) brush and the inspection.  Might not be the most efficient way, but time I got.     

The run out was between .003 and .004, measured with a FUELING TOOL.  Granted some want less than .002, H-D considers up to .012 to be acceptable, so it is kind of a moving scale.  I have chain driven cams and consider this measurement to be acceptable. 

QuoteLifter rollers look shot to.

This one I am curious about.  Truth be told I am changing the lifters to a different model (since I'm there) but these have only been on the bike for less than 10K miles and I planned on saving them.  I went back out after reading this and they do not show any real wear, that I could see or feel.  What made them look shot? 

Getting new cams now (likely SE255), but can't work on that until next weekend due to time involved and I won't get the cams until the middle of the week.  Likely will go ahead and change the cam bearings some evening though.

QuoteIf too far out of round, perhaps a slight overbore to clean up, new pistons to fit, not a real increase in size.

I've taken the front cylinder and piston off to clean and check.  The bore on the front was uniform all the way down measured on four different lines.  I am "assuming" (bad word) that out of round would show up as larger in some places and tighter in others.  I suppose after I get the piston cleaned I could reinstall and check side clearances around the edge at different depths. 
 

Instead of the 255, why not consider the Andrews 48 instead.

The rollers on the 2 lifters in the picture look frosted for lack of a better word, like some debris has gone thru them. The one that was riding that damaged lobe cant be very pretty. Others have said on here lifters are a dirt trap. Oil goes thru the lifter passages to the piston oilers, don't take much to stick one of those. I would flip the heads and check the valve to seat seal with some varsol and see if they leak.  Bob

QuoteThe rollers on the 2 lifters in the picture look frosted for lack of a better word, like some debris has gone thru them. The one that was riding that damaged lobe cant be very pretty.

Fair enough.  Lots of carbon on the pistons, especially the front, so some of that was likely floating around.  The heads (certainly the front) are an issue and sending them the Larry in Chicago, always wanted to see what a difference he could make and now is the perfect time.  I was expecting to see something on the roller that was riding that lifter too, but I can't find it.  I always was changing the lifters but now I see that I should not save that set at all.

I believe the front exhaust valve was leaking, after it failed the compression and leak down tests, I took the exhaust off and put air into the front cylinder (like a leak down) and it was blowing out the front.  Had the intake off too and it appeared tight.  Heads boxed up now.

QuoteInstead of the 255, why not consider the Andrews 48 instead.

I have the 255 in a 2008 Ultra with a 110 and like the way it rides.  There have been a lot of discussions / debates (sometimes heated) here about various cams and which one is the best.  Similar to oil.  Interesting to read for me, but honestly I do not know enough to fully appreciate the differences that a little more timing here, or less there can make. 

Open to suggestions that would fit my riding.  Not looking to be the fastest as that comes with a trade-off.  My riding is almost all traveling now, always two-up, I'm 6-3 and 235, my wife is no longer 105 lbs (not going to ask), bike & bag loaded for several days and never pull a trailer.  Typical day is about 500 miles on two lane roads.  Will cruise about 10 mph over the posted speed, unless talking about the WY interstate where the posted speed is fine.     
 
               

If you like the way the 255s work, but want a little more, I like the TTS100 cam- it beats the SE255 everywhere, and I've not found a cam that is better from idle to 4500 RPM @ less than 10:1 compression.

Quote from: rigidthumper on July 12, 2020, 06:10:36 AM
If you like the way the 255s work, but want a little more, I like the TTS100 cam- it beats the SE255 everywhere, and I've not found a cam that is better from idle to 4500 RPM @ less than 10:1 compression.

This is how I feel about the Andrews 48. Either of these cams I would recommend over the heat-producing 255.

Quote from: rigidthumper on July 12, 2020, 06:10:36 AM
If you like the way the 255s work, but want a little more, I like the TTS100 cam- it beats the SE255 everywhere, and I've not found a cam that is better from idle to 4500 RPM @ less than 10:1 compression.

solid advice right here 

Looks like I need to do more investigation into choice of cams.

The SE255 is the OEM cams on 110 CVOs and doing some reading they have some history of damage at the front exhaust lobe.  Which seems curious since I have always felt that the rear is exposed to more heat due to less air.  Obviously more factors involved that I don't know.     

Quote from: chaos901 on July 13, 2020, 07:15:32 AM
Looks like I need to do more investigation into choice of cams.

The SE255 is the OEM cams on 110 CVOs and doing some reading they have some history of damage at the front exhaust lobe.  Which seems curious since I have always felt that the rear is exposed to more heat due to less air.  Obviously more factors involved that I don't know.     

I think it has a lot to do with the profile of the 255 cam combined with the heavy springs of the 110" heads (beating on cam lobes and lifters).

Have whoever is cleaning up your heads select a cam that suits the work they are performing (there are Plenty of excellent choices). You'll get everything you like from the 255 plus a set up that's cooler running and easier on the valve train (reliability and longevity of parts).

With a mild bump in compression
Rs/zippers 587 works very well

As mentioned above, I did seek Larry's opinion on the cam choice.  Since I liked the 255 I would be happy with the TTS100, called Phil and got one on the way.  Hopefully get them before this weekend. 

New,lighter valve springs?

The valve springs are being changed as part of the head package, honestly I don't know if lighter or not, but I trust that Larry does it right.

Never ever trust Larry! His work leads to clutch and rear tire wear along with speeding tickets.
R Meyer

whatcha call unintended consequence?   

Update:  A week or so ago I pulled the full roller cam bearings I had had installed a year ago while waiting on the new cams (TTS-100).  I had gotten a gasket kit from my dealer and went to install their cam bearings and noticed that they were the original cage type, should have known honestly.  Decided to proceed with the OEM type bearings, would change the bearings over the winter.  Installed the new cams in the original cam plate and installed them with the original oil pump.  Thought about it for awhile and decided that with all that is being done I really need to change the cam plate and pump too.  So called Phil and got the S&S set delivered, along with some full roller bearings from George.  Got all that in easy enough Saturday morning, new tensioners too. 

Rings should be delivered today, deglazed and cleaned the cylinders last weekend, coated the bores with oil after washing.  Got the carbon off the pistons.  Will clean the cylinders again before I set them.  Got the cylinder base o-rings and gaskets thru the rockers.   

Hope to have the heads back sometime next week.   

The new rings came, there were MAHLE rings for a 4" bore but the thickness was wrong, should have known better.  So I got new OEM pistons and rings.  Considered the S & S pistons but decided against after some consultations.  Did not hear anything bad about them, just did not want that big a jump in compression. 

Only lost one finger installing the circlips.     

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I didn't see it in your posts- did you get Cometic .030" head gaskets? 

QuoteI didn't see it in your posts- did you get Cometic .030" head gaskets?

I did not, I have new OEM head gaskets.  Never opposed to more education, what would be the overall benefit? 

Better control of detonation (pinging is reduced).

Changing from the stock head gasket (.045"-.052" compressed) to the Cometic .030" unit will result in a slight bump in compression (will take you from 9.2:1 to 9.56:1), which typically results in a slight bump in efficiency, TQ, & HP.

Interesting.....will certainly consider. 

EDIT: Got some coming.

Quote from: chaos901 on August 04, 2020, 11:10:35 AM
Interesting.....will certainly consider. 

EDIT: Got some coming.

   

Drove back and forth to Chicago yesterday and picked up my heads.  The "after" pictures are a whole prettier than the the "before". 

Got it all together.  First time I reused the OEM pushrods, started it up but shut it down within about 20 seconds.  Had oil pressure but did not like a noise.  Took it back down to pull the heads to make sure a valve was not hitting a piston, was not.  Put it back together but this time I used adjustable pushrods.   

Tuned at the local H-D Dealer with Power Vision, the SERT that came with the bike was corrupted.  Pick it up this afternoon.